User talk:Kim

Hi all. I made my first spelling correction today. Woo hoo. I will occasionally drift through to do that while I learn my way around if that's ok. Kim

• You mean (in my enthusiasm) I made a spelling mistake? :) Thanks Kim, It takes a while to get the concept of this wiki down, but it will come. One tip --- If you wish to sign your name to anything, just placing 4 'tildes'(`) will put your name and a date stamp like I will do at the end of this. Also, anytime you wish to know if someone has responded or changed anything on any page, you can check 'watch this page.' Then by clicking on your watch list at the top, you will see. Dypsisdean 13:42, 21 May 2007 (PDT)
• Note: If you don't get a photo or short intro up on your user page, someone might do it for you. :) Dypsisdean 13:42, 21 May 2007 (PDT)

Uh oh. : ) I'll work on the intro. Trying your tilde tip.Kim 15:29, 21 May 2007 (PDT)

• You're a fast learner. I wish everyone was. :) Dypsisdean 15:38, 21 May 2007 (PDT)

You're catching on

I can 'see' you struggling along. I am still learning a lot of things myself. This on the job training is hit and miss. Go to my talk page. I answered your latest question there. Dypsisdean 18:13, 21 May 2007 (PDT)

• I think I misunderstood your question now that I see you used an external link to your Jubaea pic. Click edit and notice the syntax I used to give you a clickable thumbnail with a caption after I uploaded your photo to the wiki using the 'Upload file' link on the left of every page. Dypsisdean 18:21, 21 May 2007 (PDT)

Missing file

I went to 'Special Pages'/'Unused files' and found your self portrait there. I could have deleted it, but decided to let you see if you can find it and do it. :) It was #89, but that could change if more photos are uploaded. Dypsisdean 13:10, 22 May 2007 (PDT)

• Kim, that was it. You were not able to delete images. Only sysops can. Once you get the hang of everything, I can make you one, because you are obviously not as "thick" as you think you are. :) Dypsisdean 13:52, 22 May 2007 (PDT)

• Sysops? Noooooooooo! (Insert photo of Edvard Munch's The Scream) Hmmm, when I examine your motivation, I wonder if you are the competitive type. Kim 14:15, 22 May 2007 (PDT)
• Competitive??? Yes..... But only in things that lend themselves to competition. I guess I need something palmy to do when it's raining. If you want a laugh, listen to one of my "experiments." I was trying to figure out how to do a real audio interview with Gary Levine about his Madagascar trip. Go to "Resources" on the Main Page and click on it. You should then see a link to "Interview with Gary Levine." Dypsisdean 14:27, 22 May 2007 (PDT)

• I listened to that yesterday. I am reasonably certain that the, uh, interviewer, uh, was the same person as the, uh, uh, the, uh, interviewee. That was pretty funny. Especially when you got to the Richard Nixon comparison. I was going to write a comment: "What the hell..???" But I didn't think you'd appreciate it. Kim 14:38, 22 May 2007 (PDT)
• Where were you when I needed you, in English 101? Dypsisdean 00:08, 8 June 2007 (PDT)
• Mmmm, probably hiding out in French 411. Is more written content coming? I wonder why people who write a lot on the palm board aren't writing here. Are people concerned about giving away potentially valuable information for free? I can see if someone were writing a palm book why they might not come in. One section I don't quite understand is the species zone scale. If I can grow Howea forsteriana, but not Areca vestiara, does that mean I should add the species I grow successfully to zone #3B? It almost seems like it should have a horizontal component as well as a vertical component, arid to humid. Too complicated? Kim 12:59, 8 June 2007 (PDT)
• I think most people are intimidated by the format. They see funny symbols and freak. Also, you would be surprised how many people are too afraid, or too internet challenged, that have asked, "Are you going to have a list of palms someday?" To which I reply, "Did you click on the link after the big rotating green arrow that says "click here?"......."Oh"
• The SZS is an attempt to quantify something that I think is unquantifiable. I thought if you could have a scale by relative hardiness, it would apply for any specific area and be more universal than the present zone system. The temp approach is so subjective and so open to bad data from bad temp readings, that we only have a semi successful system anyway. In your example, Zone 4 has A. vestiaria as the middle of the range with Kentia at the very beginning. Zone 4 was a tough one because I couldn't come up with a common palm that would represent the middle of the range. The idea was to have an easy way for new growers to pick palms. If they drove around their neighbohood and saw Kings, but no Kentias, then they could go to the SZS and pick any palms that were farther up/down the scale from Kings, assuming for sure that anything appearing as more tender than Kentias would certainly be a no go. Presently people look at a palm and like it, only to look up the requirements and see they can't grow it. This way they could easily find a limiting palm for their area, and anything appearing as more hardy, they could choose from. It will be a difficult project, but there was so much interest in the freeze thread at PT that I thought it a good way to organize all that data. In the future, to address your humidity issue, perhaps we could have a "data engine" that would help you pick a palm for your area, based on proximity to ocean, soil, high temp, low temp, humidity, rarity, palmate/pinnate, etc. Kind of like on line shopping when you pick a refrigerator. You first select your price range, then your size, then side by side or otherwise, then color, until you get a list of your remaining options. A lot of work, but probably very useful.
• Too much to do all at once. I have a new bigger better server all ready to go, I think. I'm testing it today. So if the site is down in the next few days, the address is just being transfered. If you continue to have problems, empty your cache, and try again. BTW --- I'm in town until Wed. Dypsisdean 11:05, 8 June 2007 (PDT)
• You're in town? San Diego? Hey if you happen to get downtown, stop by my office, I'll take you to lunch. We can talk about the market and palms. Kim 12:59, 8 June 2007 (PDT)
• As far as the SZS and a data engine for palm shoppers, didn't Jungle Music add something like that to their web site? I haven't used it, I guess I should check it out.
• I had a large short position Mon, Tues, and Wed. Too bad I closed it out Wed at the close. But then again, would I have been smart enough to have sold it on Thurs. at the close? Probably not. Talk about volatility. :)
• I'm only here for 5 days, or else I would take you up on that offer. Thanks though, I'll take a rain check. I haven't been downtown in a decade. I have a very full schedule at this point. I did hear that Phil has a palm shoppers guide of some sort. I haven't checked it out either. I will tonight. I am going by to visit him tomorrow. Dypsisdean 12:42, 8 June 2007 (PDT)
• Well the shorts are certainly covering today ahead of the weekend. You did well enough as it was. Never be greedy. : ) 5 days is a quick trip, some other time. What brings you to SD? Kim 12:59, 8 June 2007 (PDT)

Hi Kim!

Hey just pokin' around and saw you. Howdy! The zoom is cool, you can see every little morsel on our plates!hahaMattyB 15:34, 8 June 2007 (PDT)

Motley Crew

Hi MattyB!

• I have to learn to do that trick. Or is it automatic with any uploaded pic? Your plate looks especially tasty in the foreground. How 'bout that smirk on Bill's face?

How's the house coming? Are you out of boxes yet? Put some more comments about palms you grow on this site, it's a little bare, info-wise. Kim 17:19, 8 June 2007 (PDT)

• Kim, different browsers handle the zoom differently. And then it may depend on the settings you have it set for, as in size to fit, or actual size. Usually it either happens automatically or you may have to click the photo once or twice more. Classic shot whether zooming or not. Dypsisdean 21:07, 8 June 2007 (PDT)
• Thanks for the props on the P.elegans post. It's starting to become real fun when all the links are available to slide through to other dimensions......oh wait...that's something else I'm working on.MattyB 10:14, 13 June 2007 (PDT)

What happened???

Hey, how come you decided to delete your comments about the slideshow over on the other page? I was just getting ready to answer you. :-)

Something New

Kim, Do you have the Quick Time player on your computer? If you do, I have something for you to watch. Dypsisdean 12:56, 18 July 2007 (PDT) I can try, but I doubt it will work here at the office. Some things get filtered out here, like the birds you emailed, but I never know. What is it? The suspense is killing me...Kim 14:06, 18 July 2007 (PDT)

• Oh Oh, It's not worth the suspense. I just thought it was kinda neat because it can easily explain to people how to do things on the wiki, and elsewhere. It's called a screencast. But most don't know what that is. It will take about a full minute to download and then play if you have QuickTime. If the birds didn't work this probably won't either. Give me a good address to send the birds to, and I will. So, try this: Screencast
• If it looks like it is just sitting there, it may be loading. Otherwise, try it at home. Dypsisdean 15:57, 18 July 2007 (PDT)
• Well that is pretty cool. You are quite the geek. ; ) It works fine at home (as do the birds) but not at work, for obvious reasons. I have seen a tutorial like this once before on another site; it can be very helpful if people will actually look at it. (I was trying to click on bill pay on the upper part of the screen and have you pay all my bills, but it didn't work!! Rats...)Kim 17:03, 18 July 2007 (PDT)

Page Spelling, etc.

• Hey, Not sure if you caught my explanation about the spelling changes and broken links over on my talk page. It's easy to miss communiques here. I answered your question there. Are you going to the PSSC meeting? FYI --- I have approached elHoagie, and will talk with others about putting the PSSC Journal online in Palmpedia. Maybe just a teaser article each month, or complete older Journals. It would help get traffic here, and should help boost PSSC membership if those around the world see the quality of the publication. Jack says they have been thinking about it for their own site, but it's a lot of work. IMO, they are thinking of doing it in pdf format, which I hate. The wiki would be great. Very easy, and configurable, and could include inside and outside links to all sorts of places on the PSSC site and/or the IPS site if they ever get theirs going.
• Anyway, I was just letting you know because you are one of the few who have gotten a taste of the potential of the wiki. So in case you are going to the meeting and hear anything, (or talk to anyone in the future), you can chime in. I suggested letting me post one article and see how it works for Palmpedia and the PSSC. Dypsisdean 13:49, 20 July 2007 (PDT)
• Yes, I caught the explanation, hope to experiment with it some evening soon. I will need many windows open: metric converter, BBC Kew list, and two palmpedia windows to work. I would like to get through the whole list and be done with it. Then just edit new material as it comes in.
• I like your journal idea, but I have no influence with the board, and I will not be there tomorrow. The best reason to put the journal online is it can be distributed faster. They are always behind on publication. This way they could get it out online and follow up with the print version.
• Aren't you the one who said she didn't know very much, so didn't have a lot to offer? :-) Dypsisdean 15:13, 20 July 2007 (PDT)
• So how do you feel about alphabetical order? And names that aren't on the Kew list as current, i.e. they have been renamed? I'm not going there now, but at some point you'll want to make some choices. For now I'll stick to spelling and punctuation.Kim 19:50, 20 July 2007 (PDT)
• Well alphabetical is good, of course. If they aren't in the right order, it's just an oversight (euphenism for screw up). And the renamings, unaccepted names, synonyms, etc. will be case by case, I guess. There is a space for synonyms in the PalmBox. Do you have any idea how to do one of those? I will show you (maybe in a screencast) if you want to know. Maybe we could make a page for things to check out later. We could make notes there. That way we wouldn't forget. Dypsisdean 21:04, 20 July 2007 (PDT)
• A 'Notes' page is a great idea. Start with Butia pimo and Calyptrocalyx kainlas. These are nowhere to be found on the Kew list. I can understand things like special variety names or variegated forms not showing up, but I don't know what to make of these two. And I still haven't made it to Dypsis yet! That's going to be interesting.... So are Calamus species ugly palms or something? There are a million of them on the Kew list, but none in Palmpedia. Just made me curious. : ) Kim 21:23, 20 July 2007 (PDT)
• Man Oh Man, I bet you had no idea what your 'little project" would turn into once you got started. :-) I sure didn't. I see what you are going through. I thought it was nice that Geoff named most of his photos when he uploaded them. I was just going off his spelling when I created the palm pages for them. You're quickly turning into a species expert. Thank you very much.
• I wish everybody could pick up wiki navigation like you can. Most everyone else gives up before they even get started. :(
• As far a Calamus goes. They are great palms. I think their rambling untidy nature and "barbs" that grab at you, make them unattractive for most situations. Dypsisdean 20:51, 21 July 2007 (PDT)
• Well, it's easy, but I think I'm burned out for tonight.Kim 21:01, 21 July 2007 (PDT)
• Please notice I put a "Discussion/Note Page" at the end of the main species listing page. ACCEPTED AND PROPER NAME DISCUSSION PAGE I hope you don't mind that I put your email notes regarding your initial screenings there. If so, just sysop 'em out. You will see my suggestion that we have a 'symbol' or something to place with palms that find their way onto the list, but are not yet officially accepted by Kew. At least that way we can include names that are widely used and understood in the trade, but are not "scientifically" valid. Sort of a 'disclaimer." Do you think that's a good strategy? Dypsisdean 21:48, 21 July 2007 (PDT)
• Well it looks good to me but maybe run it by a more discerning authority, like Geoff?Kim 22:00, 21 July 2007 (PDT)

Need Sysop Input

• Hello fellow sysop. Do you speak Spanish too?
• I would like your opinion on something regarding the PalmBox. Do you think the title (Species Name at the top) looks better in standard font or italicized?
• ¡Sí, cómo no! Pues, un poco... ¿Porqué me preguntas eso?
• It probably doesn't matter as long as it is consistent throughout. I like italicized, but since it's a title, you can choose whatever looks best to you, boss.
• Question: what do the red exclamation points mean? (in Recent changes) I thought I had it figured out (unlinked pages?) but when I clicked around, that didn't seem to be it after all. When Luis creates a new page, as he described, using a search, does that create a new title for the index automatically?
• Next question: I've been using the Recent changes page to review new additions, is that the best method? I'm running out of things to do. Kim 10:06, 3 August 2007 (PDT)
• I can answer two at once. I use the recent changes as well. That's how I saw your roll back (deletion) of your comment to Luis that started in Spanish. Hablo Espanol tambien. Pero yo no se como hacer la punctuacion. :-(
• I'm not sure about the red exclamation marks. I thought you were right, until I checked it out. As near as I can tell it looks like it's every change by Luis or Geoff. So possibly it's an alert for every change not made by a sysop.
• And no, when Luis does that trick, it's a backdoor to making a new page. So a page linking to it needs to be made. He does that since he can't create a new listing for a new species.
• Don't worry, there will be stuff to do. Geoff is sending me a few thousand pics to watermark, and then we will begin uploading them. Plus, hopefully he will be adding some descriptions, etc.
• Hm, so I can't hide my edits after all. :p If you would find it useful, I can email you the key to typing the Spanish punctuation.
• A few thousand pics! All new species to enter? Yes, I will have stuff to do... : )
• Geoff is sending them to me, I will watermark them and send them back --- all snail mail, so it will be a little while. That's assuming he copied everything in a format I can use. I've had a germination article almost done for a month already. I'll try to get it done so you can spruce it up some. :-) Have you checked the freeze data that he has filled in? I haven't got around to organizing it yet, but I bet there's some species spelling errors there if you really want something to do, since you've become a species spelling expert. :)
• I could use the Spanish key strokes from time to time. However, I'm on a Mac, so I bet they aren't the same, and I'm sure I could dig them up somewhere. Have you memorized them, or do you have to look every one up as you are typing? Dypsisdean 19:17, 3 August 2007 (PDT)
• If I go to "Recent Changes" and see a change, then go there and can't see any change, I go to "History." From there you can compare the last change with the previous. That's where I could see you deleted your comments about the red exclamation. Dypsisdean 19:20, 3 August 2007 (PDT)

BTW --- Are you using the "Watch this page" feature? Dypsisdean 19:21, 3 August 2007 (PDT)

• Hfff. Mac superiority complex. Ok....  ; ) Oh, yes, I have them all memorized. Me and Rain Man. If I used them all the time, maybe; but the need is rather infrequent.
• Oh, right, the freeze data... I left it alone. It's going to be massive because he mentions species that aren't on the list yet, but that I figured will show up eventually. (Are they all going to be hot-linked? And after the last snafu, I didn't want to trip over his work. His spelling looks pretty good anyway. Species spelling expert, you flatter me. I see you working. I will take a look. (See, you always get what you want.)
• Re: Watch this page-- I have used it, but not consistently. Besides, it's no fun to watch things that don't change.Kim 19:54, 3 August 2007 (PDT)
• Mmm. Ok, I looked at several pages of the SZS, and we have the problem of unaccepted names. For example, Brahea nitida is mentioned, but it is a synonym of Brahea calcarea. Do you want me to insert (syn. of Brahea calcarea), or ??? I expect this scenario to repeat again and again, so we should establish a set method. Kim 20:52, 3 August 2007 (PDT)
• Hmmmm, Let me give it some thought. Your question got me thinking about some other things. Like how to integrate the SZS in with everything else via links. More importantly, I am going to need to do a little work on the search feature and how it really works. For example, if someone is looking for the hardiness of a particular species, as it is now, they will have to scan through the list looking for it. Not very effecient. So a link to the specific zone page from the species page seems obvious. And the PalmPages have the PalmBox entry for synonyms already. And the PalmBox also has the Hardiness space that can be a link to the Zone Page. I'll experiment with the search, because it would be nice if the search was totally functional. I think I am beginning to understand why there are these things called 'Namespaces.' They may be there purely for the search feature. For example, you could search strictly within a namespace, say for Hardiness, for H. belmoreana, and it would only return the references in the Hardiness namespace. If so, I need to recreate the SZS in it's own namespace. At any rate, we need to be consistent with the Main Online Reference, and we need to keep track of synonyms in the PalmBox on that page. As far as linking and searching, I'll give it some thought.
• I don't think I clearly answered your question. I think, at this point, we should take any synonyms in the SZS and change them to the accepted name, and place that synonym into the PalmBox on that species' PalmPage. That way all searches will be uniform. And I believe a search for the synonym should still yield a result to that species PalmPage. I'll play around, and see how it all works. Dypsisdean 13:27, 4 August 2007 (PDT)
• I'd have to make a chart to figure out all the possibilities for interlinking. It's going to end up like a spider web, except more complicated. Until you have a handle on how you want things integrated, I will do only basic edits in the Survivability Index, i.e. spelling, italics, metric, and F/C conversions. Next run through I'll work on verifying all the names, changing out the synonyms to the palm box, and lastly, establish links, because by then you'll have it all figured out. Sound ok? So eventually all palms show up in both the main index and the survivability index and are all cross-referenced? Very impressive. Better let Geoff know I'm dogging the names, or he might go back and put them in again, thinking he accidentally left them out or they disappeared.
• One more question: how long before this shows up in google searches? I did a search today on Hyophorbe indica (planted mine today), and found three wiki listings, one in German, all with the same photo, but not the Palmpedia, at least not on the first 3 pages of results. Just curious.
• Roger all that. I would imagine the chances of you and Geoff working on the same project at the same time would be slim. Especially now that you are both watching out for each other. :)
• To verify, when I was talking search, I was referring to the search witin the wiki. That is, the search box to the left. I think you knew that. However, Re: Google searches --- That is a very difficult question. Google keeps their criteria for searching secret so people don't 'artificially' manipulate it. For example, if it depended on the number of hits, then it would be easy to write a program that would just visit a particular site all day long. Suppossedly, one of the main criteia is the number of people that click through to you from a popular site that has linked to you and visa versa. In other words it's a complicated series of algorithms, that is top secret. They share some of it, and change it constantly to (as they say) keep it pertinent. There are companies that advertise they can move you up in the rankings. Some I suppose are legit, some not, some can help, others probably not.....I think the short answer is time and traffic.
• As far as H.indica goes. We have very few (if any) written references to it. In fact, I think I don't think we have the whole name - Hyophorbe indica - anywhere. Maybe in the SI. For this reason, I may have made a mistake in abbreviating the species in the Palm Pages like H. indica. That is one reason I am trying to start off the descriptions with the full name. And the full name in the PalmBox should help as well. H. indica has no text, so no references. :( BTW --- feel free to create a PalmBox on any page that doesn't have one. That would help get the names out there until we get more descriptions. I know you could figure it out. Luis made a nice help page here. http://palmpedia.net/wiki/index.php/Help:Palmbox Dypsisdean 12:45, 5 August 2007 (PDT)

Palmbox Info

• Thanks for your edit in my H. indica effort. I have a lot to learn about formatting. (rolling eyes) I realized just now I've been confusing two pages, the Species Zone Scale/SZS and the Survivability Index/SI. Does the Survivability Index replace the SZS? I'm a little confused because the hardiness info I put in the H. indica Palmbox links to the SZS, which doesn't show up on the Main Page. I don't know how the link happened. Also the link just goes to the whole index, not to the palm name in question within the text, so a user would still have to look through every zone to find the one palm. (To be clear, this is not a complaint, I'm trying to figure out how to make it work better.)Kim 13:28, 6 August 2007 (PDT)
• Feel free to complain, as I would only take it as the constructive type. :)
• Give yourself some credit. You are picking up this editing stuff at a brisk pace. The Palmbox is a "different animal" when it comes to editing. The wiki rules no longer apply. The rules are dictated by how the code for the box was written. For example, Luis made it so just entering the file (photo) name would automatically size it, and recognize it as an image without having to include any wiki markup. He is still fine tuning the code. FYI --- Palmbox discussion
• You will see that I have started to talk with Luis about links to the SI from the Palmbox. Your link was probably generated by the code within the box. I will check that out. As you noted, it will be important to have that link go to the page (zone) pertaining to that palm, and not the main SI page. And yes the SI is replacing the SZS. This was a reluctant change on my part recognizing that one size wouldn't fit all. Therefore the Med and Sub distinctions. And Geoff keeps mentioning the importance of humidity, but I didn't want to further complicate things with a desert zone. So I thought a "Survivablity Scale" with hardiness being the main criterion, and then qualifications for other things related to survivabilty that may be unique for a particular palm like soil, sun/shade, "wet feet," hot/dry lovers, etc. Dypsisdean 14:04, 6 August 2007 (PDT)
• Kim, Don't freak about your H. indica page. I put something there for Luis to see that messed up the Palmbox. So it is intentional for now. Dypsisdean 22:22, 6 August 2007 (PDT)
• It looks different this morning than it did last night. : ) Not freaking.
• I looked at the Survivability Index in more detail; it doesn't appear ready for editing yet. Are you guys still experimenting with formats? Kim 08:01, 7 August 2007 (PDT)
• So far, except for the very beginning, that is all Geoff's work. I took his MSI 1A & 1B and tried to make a workable format, hoping he would follow the same outline in the rest. I don't think he felt comfortable (or didn't notice) arranging things in that format. So I intend to go through it and make them all like 1A & 1B. Dypsisdean 13:22, 7 August 2007 (PDT)
• I received about 3500 photos from Geoff last night. I watermarked them and sent them back. So there will be many more uploads to list, proof, and arrange soon. Dypsisdean 13:23, 7 August 2007 (PDT)
• Luis fixed that SI code, so you may not have even seen the weirdness on the H. indica page. We can now enter a MSI=x and a SSI=x and it will link to the page for that designation. Dypsisdean 13:33, 7 August 2007 (PDT)
• The palmbox looked really wide last night, normal today. I moved the link from 2A to 4A -- it's so perfect, that's exactly what I was hoping you meant, very cool. I like your format (as in MSI 1A & 1B) because it's easy to find the palm names, nice and clean, KISS concept. I expect I'll have time this evening to work on things, so I'll start with checking the names in that section unless there is something else you'd rather I do.
• 3,500 photos, whew. That's awesome. (choke) Any idea how many names? Kim 14:50, 7 August 2007 (PDT)
• No idea. Of course there are many multiples of the same palm, and a lot that we already have, and I haven't had a chance to view them all. If you care to assist in getting them to the right pages, you're hired. :-) It's no more complicated than copying and pasting the Image tag to the proper location after they get uploaded. The new ones of course, need a new page created. If you do choose to volunteer, we should have a strategy so as not to duplicate each other's work. If you would prefer not to get involved, don't hesitate to decline the offer. :-) You are already providing much needed assistance. Dypsisdean 15:27, 7 August 2007 (PDT)
• A trivial picky question --- Do you think "Survival Index" sounds better than "Survivability Index?" Dypsisdean 15:30, 7 August 2007 (PDT)
• In the opinion of one who can be trivial and picky, yes, much better! Kim 15:36, 7 August 2007 (PDT)
• Now that I think about it, 'survivability' sounds like what you'd measure after a nuclear blast. Kim 21:10, 7 August 2007 (PDT)
• After that winter you guys had, maybe that is the more appropriate term. :-)
• What do you like better, Survival Index or Survival Scale? Dypsisdean 22:16, 7 August 2007 (PDT)
• I think I just answered my own question. Survival Scale sounds like an indestructible plant pest. :)
• Don't buy a camera until we talk. I think I can give you some good advice. I just did a lot of research before I bought my new one last month.
• BTW --- I was thinking about correcting your typo. But it was giving me some kind of perverse comfort. :-) Dypsisdean 13:53, 8 August 2007 (PDT)
• Survival Index it is then. (laughing) Did you guess it was your photo with the luminous fruit? How do you DO that? Really outstanding photography. I'd like to hear about your research, definitely.
• Typo, well, er, I was hoping you hadn't noticed that.... and I don't say nuke-ya-ler either.
• Last night my son came in to use the computer while I was editing and he said, "Mom, get a life, nobody cares!" Sniff. I guess I won't get into uploading 3,500 photos or they'll arrange an intervention...Kim 15:24, 8 August 2007 (PDT)
• Tell that little trouble maker that some kids have it so rough they live with a mother that doesn't even know what a hard drive is. Dypsisdean 18:02, 8 August 2007 (PDT)

) You know how it is, when you're 19 you know everything. Kim 12:04, 9 August 2007 (PDT)

Two Requests

• I invoked your name while trying to answer a question by Luis. What do you think? Luis' Question
• And I finally got my germination article up. I decided if I waited until I completed it entirely, it would never see the light of day. I've still got more to add, but it could already use a little of your "polish." :) A Primer On Germinating Palm Seeds Dypsisdean 18:36, 11 August 2007 (PDT)
• I did a fast edit; looks pretty decent. I'm still trying to decide if "getting bit" and "getting hooked" work well in a single sentence.  ; )

Mahalo

• Kim, Thanks for jumping on those corrections so quickly. It was late last night, and I did try some quick checks on some of those. I'm just trying to keep up with Geoff's uploads so I don't fall too far behind, especially with hurricane prep going on. Hopefully I wouldn't loose internet service during the next 24-36 hrs. Dypsisdean 11:50, 14 August 2007 (PDT)
• There's so much info going in it's best for me to jump on it before it scrolls off the 'recent changes' page -- even with 500 changes listed, it rolls by fast. If I miss it there, then I'll have to go through the whole list item by item. I doubt I'll catch them all as they come in, but I'll try.
• I thought this hurrican was not going to roll by in the distance, no?Kim 12:35, 14 August 2007 (PDT)
• Well, with the eye 80-100 miles south, and the way the terrain is set up with the volcanoes, I think Kona is protected. Now they are predicting the SoEast facing part of the island to get 10 inches and 50 MPH winds. I'll take the 10 inches, but not the wind. As I write this, the eye just showed up on the radar. So it still looks to pass about 100 miles south with tropical storm force winds out to 140 miles. We'll see. They have been known to be unpredictable. Dypsisdean 15:11, 14 August 2007 (PDT)

new pic

Hey there Kim. I found a pic from the PSSC meeting in LA and I wanted to share it so I posted it to your user page. Hope you don't mind. It's very flattering......of your hair! : )MattyB 15:06, 5 September 2007 (PDT)

• Nice backpack, eh? Kim 15:47, 7 September 2007 (PDT)

Hi Kim!

Thanks for the kind compliment about my user page! I've never done anything having to do with code before... I'm just experimenting and piecing things together. The names of my new two best friends are "Copy" and "Paste"! I was so "stoked" when I managed to get my recording (which I recorded myself in Bali) to play on my page. Maybe this way, a few folks will hear it!! That would be soo cool!! Paul and I are going to have a lot of fun with this!--Anjali 16:32, 16 September 2007 (PDT)

Whew

For a second there I thought I might have spelled every "Curiosities" wrong. Dypsisdean 00:13, 20 September 2007 (PDT)

Hyophorbe/Caryota

Hi and thanks for adding content to the Palmpedia. I respectfully request you review your work before you 'save'. I'm looking at Hyophorbe verschaffeltii and it has a palmbox for H. lagenicaulis, and a new Caryota gigas page when the name doesn't conform to the RBG Kew list. I don't want to discourage your participation, because you are making great contributions, it's just that I spent a huge number of hours reviewing, verifying and editing the names and I don't want to have to do the whole thing over again, if you follow. So could you please fix your Hyophorbe pages? Also, I'd like to see some of the photos restored. Thanks. Kim 09:57, 5

Thanks for the note Kim. As per your request, I usually make an effort to review my work before and after I save it. Occasionally, and sometimes frequently, I make errors. In the wiki format I usually make the observation that in the time it takes for people to point out my errors to me, they could have just as easily corrected the edits themselves. Anyway, Caryota gigas was an existing page which I just added something to, it wasn't a page I started. As I was copying and pasting the Hyophorbe palmboxes I may have forgotten to change a line of the text, I will go back and look at that. I dont know what you mean about restoring photos. Many pages have that strange long line of thumbnail pics down the right margin, some of which I condensed some into gallery format. The only pic I deleted was by User:Palmbob which was a Brahea or something on the Bismarckia page which was clearly misplaced. Hope that helps. ThanksMmcknight4 10:18, 5 November 2007 (PST)

Hi - yes, I could fix your mistakes in the time it takes to point them out to you; however, I would prefer that you take responsibility for your work and take a few extra seconds to prevent the mistakes in the first place. The specific photo I was missing is a fantastic pair of H. verschaffeltii in Point Loma. Kim 10:41, 5 November 2007 (PST)

Ok, I found the missing pic, the pair is indeed fantastic, and it is again posted on the page. Now Im not going to get in a big thing with you about 'responsibility for your work'. I spent my Sunday editing Palmpedia and Wikipedia for the same reasons that most people do: to gather, accumulate, and organize world knowledge to present in a free forum. If your biggest complaint is the Hyophorbe typo and the temporarily misplaced picture then I feel like my contributions to the project were largely responsible. Mistakes, typos, and missing pictures happen in these forums and nobody is less guilty than another. And the fact of the matter is, its just easier to fix errors rather than seek out the guilty party and ask them to change it. And once this project matures into many users, that approach will be all the more unpractical. Anyway, thanks for the heads up. What do you think about picking an article which already has a lot of content (maybe Bismarckia) and getting a few people to focus on it and try to come up with a more or less 'ideal' article to serve as a model. I think I, and probably others, could work well from such an example. Like, at the very top, should we include a pronunciation key (bis-MARK-ee-a NO-bi-lis), and what else should the intro include besides etymology (or should etymology appear elswhere in the article). We could work our way down the page until we agree that we have an 'ideal' article, so to speak, then people can refer back to it when editing and formatting. What do you think?Mmcknight4 11:22, 5 November 2007 (PST)

• I hope I didn't over-react, but the only two things I looked at that you did, had a problem, so I spoke up. I haven't reviewed every contribution, so I can't (and won't) comment further. One of the big criticisms of wikis is they deteriorate to the lowest common denominator. True? I hope it's the reverse, and I hope my work reflects a desire for accuracy and quality. You've already heard my "heads up", and I've read your response, so let's move on. Thanks for putting back that photo, I'm kind of attached to those palms in my neighborhood.  : )
• I like your suggestion for working up a model article, including the formatting. Dean had inserted a framework, which you've seen (Habitat and Distribution, Description, Culture, Curiosities). Another good example is the Ravenea glauca page. Other pages, you may have noticed, have the framework to encourage contributions, but remain empty (for example, Copernicia baileyana). Many pages don't even have the framework yet; populating that throughout the pages might be a start. Etymology is interesting, but maybe not requiring prime position. As far as a pronunciation key goes, there is a need for it, but not at the top -- just my personal opinion, but those things look really clunky. A necessary evil, but put it further down the page? I am sure many will disagree with me on that.  ; ) Kim 12:51, 5 November 2007 (PST)

Ok, well we should should definitely round up some folks, pick a palm and get a sound article together. In the interests of the wiki, maybe we should pick one like Copernicia b--Dypsisdean 21:58, 5 November 2007 (PST)aileyana which has no info and start from scratch. It may be the case that there are other pressing editing concerns which would be a better focus of attention. For instance the species list contains some 350 plant names while Arecaceae has some 2500 - 3000 species (so we have 10 or 15% of the total). MAybe we should also pick a genus as the subject for collaboration and try to round up all the described species within it. Since Hyophorbe is on the surface, we could start there. Ive got it listed as containing 5 species; H. amaricaulis, H. indica, H. lagencaulis, H. verschaffeltii and H. vaughanii, but the species list currently shows just three. If there was a Hyophorbe page, the discussion could occur there, but the need for pages at the genus level is another discussion altogether. Let me know.Mmcknight4 16:49, 5 November 2007 (PST)

• I believe policy has been not to create a page until there is some content, at least a photo. I only write about palms with which I have first-hand experience. Do you grow Copernicia baileyana? Unfortunately, I don't... Kim 20:24, 5 November 2007 (PST)
• As already noted, this project is an enormous one. Certainly bigger than one person can direct. I wish I had the wisdom and foresight to have a strategy and road map about how this project should proceed in an orderly fashion. There are many ideas and concepts which would be valuable additions to Palmpedia. However, ideas are easy to suggest, but difficult to initiate and finish, and should not be undertaken until the previous ones are finished. Toward that end, I propose we continue to concentrate on the essence of what Palmpedia should be. That is, the listing of quality pics and info about every palm species in the world. We have a long way to go. --Dypsisdean 22:05, 5 November 2007 (PST)
• The strategy I originally began with was to get as many species listed with at least one pic as possible. Then I was hoping to get descriptive contributions, however minor, to build on. So once a pic was uploaded, a page was started for that species. Then a description could follow with the layout, more pics, and more detailed descriptions. That process is still in place but was halted while we wait for a major upgrade to the server and integrated forum software that I think while help make the site more useful and easier to access information. This upgrade should occur shortly. After it is initiated, everyone will need to re-register. I am hoping, at that point, to have a better venue to discuss these types of issues, and come to a consensus of how to proceed. As already suggested, I think once we begin to upload pics again, and establish new species pages, we can pick a series of species pages and concentrate as a group on those week by week, trying to establish the actual "Palmpedia.". In other words, a weekly project agenda that we can concentrate on. Please bear with me while I try to get this new format started (any day now) and come up with a more organized plan of attack. --Dypsisdean 21:58, 5 November 2007 (PST)