Talk:MEDITERRANEAN SURVIVABILTY INDEX ZONE 1B: The Canary Zone

In addition to the average and extreme winter low temperatures, the nature of the summer growing season can have profound implications for growing success. No where is this more true than in Mediterranean climates. There are Mediterranean climates with cool summers, warm summers and hot summers. This complicates the task of creating a linear zonation system for Mediterranean climates. From the "Canary Zone", the index should perhaps bifurcate into a "Syagrus Zone" and a "Ceroxylon Zone". Even though some of these palms have very similar low temperature tolerances in winter, their summer needs are quite different (though there are some mild locations that provide a happy medium for palms from both cool and warm-summer climates). The first step in evaluating palm adaptability in Mediterranean climates is to look at what palms will be happy with the number of summer heat units you have. Then you can look at winter lows to pare the list down even more. Heat units are perhaps best measured by looking at the number of Corn Growing Degree Days (CGDD) at your local weather station. A relatively low number of CGDD can be just as limiting as one's winter frost liability. A link to a white paper that I wrote on this topic can be retrieved at the following link. It contains a preliminary list of palm adaptability listed by number of CGDD. Understand that this list is currently in need of revision and may contain disputed entries. [1]

• Steve, Thanks so much for taking the time to add to a complex subject. Of course, everything you say is relevent and of great importance. I think it is also the main reason why there is no "one size fits all" indexing for what palms grow where. However, that is the project that we have undertaken, and it has already undergone revisions and re-thinking quite a few times already. There are two main points or goals I have tried to keep paramount. The first is to create an indexing or ranking that would help the newer growers avoid the costly and disheartening planting mistakes that a brutal cold snap reveals. And two, try to do it in a format that is straight forward and easy to understand. Again, mostly for the newer growers. Experienced growers already have a feel, and know how to aquire the knowledge of their growing conditions and what they can successfully grow. The tempation and suggestions have been many to begin to start separating categories and creating niche groupings etc. It is very tempting because we all are striving for accuracy, and there are many "exceptions to the rule." The first big split or separation was the acceptance that one ranking wouldn't do it. Therefore we decided to separate into the Med and Subtropical zones. In an attempt to keep them uniform, with 10 categories each, I have resisted the sugggestions to begin separating out special exceptions within those zones. IMO, once started, it would never end, and could evolve into a cumbersome hard to understand document. But it is obvious something needs to be done. And it could always happen at some point if deemed an improvement.
• There has been much discussion between Palmbob and me on this format. Some of it still appears on his and my Talk Pages. What I have suggested there, is trying our best (at least at this point) to stay within the parameters we have. And qualifying the info with a method similar to what we have done on the Encyclopedia section by placing a symbol beside certain palms to designate special considerations. If you notice, on the species index for the Encyclopedia, we are using certain icons to convey additional info about the name. I have proposed a similar strategy for the SI. That is an icon for cool, warm, or hot preferences, and humid or dry air, or wet or dry soil. Maybe a small red sun for heat loving, orange for moderate, and blue for cool loving species. Or something along those lines. We will also have the SI page itself for each species to further expound on special conditions with anecdotal information. While at the same time, we keep a simple 10 zone approach for both the Med and Sub Indices that newer palm growers would not find overwhealming. When I have a chance I will examine your paper. A brief skim revealed some very intersting information. Your continued interest and feedback in this project would be appreciated.
• Since this project is just beginning, there are many directions it may still go. It is intended to be a group directed project, so your input is valued, and will remain here so that others may comment as well. You obviously have and interest and knowledge in this area that would only add credibility to this undertaking. Dypsisdean 12:40, 28 July 2007 (PDT)